With their 15 point margin last week, the campaign was looking like a runaway freight train for the Harper Conservatives. However, a number of new factors have diminished the Conservative lead, which is still comfortable, to 9 points.
First, Harper’s culture comments renewed BQ support in Quebec. Combine the Richardson comments related to immigrants causing crime and Harper’s comments asserting Dion wanted the economy to perform poorly and the gap narrowed from 15 to 9 points. These two comments represent a tenuous lifeline to the Liberal campaign.
Tonight, Nik Nanos, President of Nanos Research and Official CPAC Pollster, joins Goldhawk Live host Dale Goldhawk at 7 pm ET / 4 pm PT to discuss the latest results. For more detailed information on the methodology and the statistical results visit the Nanos Research website at http://www.nanosresearch.com.
Methodology and Results
A national random telephone survey is conducted nightly by Nanos Research throughout the campaign. Each evening a new group of 400 eligible voters is interviewed. The daily tracking figures are based on a three-day rolling sample comprised of 1,200 interviews. To update the tracking, a new day of interviewing is added and the oldest day dropped. The margin of accuracy is ±2.8%, 19 times out of 20 for 1,200 random interviews.
The numbers in parenthesis denote the change from the previous Nanos Research Survey completed on September 26, 2008.
Question: If a FEDERAL election were held today, could you please rank your top two current local voting preferences? (First ranked reported)
Committed Voters - Canada (N=990, MoE ± 3.1%, 19 times out of 20)
- Conservative Party 36 (-3)
- Liberal Party 27 (+2)
- NDP 19 (NC)
- Green Party 9% (NC)
- BQ 9% (+1)
- Undecided 18% (+2)
Question: Of the following individuals, who do you think would make the best Prime Minister? [Rotate] (N=1,202,MoE ± 2.8%, 19 times out of 20)
- Conservative leader Stephen Harper 36% (-1)
- NDP leader Jack Layton 18% (-1)
- Liberal leader Stephane Dion 12% (+1)
- Green Party leader Elizabeth May 4% (NC)
- Bloc Quebecois leader Gilles Duceppe 4% (NC)
- None of them 8% (NC)
- Unsure 17% (NC)
Question: Which of the federal leaders would you best describe as:
- The most trustworthy leader
- The most competent leader
- The leader with the best vision for Canada’s future
[Leadership Index Score - Daily roll-up of all three measures]
- Stephen Harper 92 (+7)
- Stephane Dion 53 (+11)
- Jack Layton 50 (-6)
- Gilles Duceppe 17 (+6)
- Elizabeth May 11 (-9)
What do you think?
Cheers, NJN
Remember to rate the views of others - to allow us to recognize the opinion leaders in our national conversation.
Individuals with the top ratings make it to Nik’s Leaderboard
Most Read Comments
Highest Rated Comments
Phew! But Harper still has a 9 point lead. Methinks he or his party would have... more
rsharp (Québec) 28 Sep 14:28
Does Canadian constitution allow formation of Green and Lib coalition government... more
shk (Ontario) 28 Sep 14:46
Things are tightening up again. Polls are like rollercoasters. Hold on and enj... more
fortescue (Ontario) 28 Sep 14:02
Wow. You're not the brightest bulb in the drawer, are you :) Nik's talented, ... more
Foxer (British Columbia) 28 Sep 21:09
I would have slept just fine with a nine point lead, much better than Stephane I... more
MRM (Manitoba) 28 Sep 21:22
rsharp 1. As a member nation we have obligations under both NATO and the UN.... more
HC in AB (Alberta) 28 Sep 21:28
Comments
fortescue
Things are tightening up again. Polls are like rollercoasters. Hold on and enjoy the ride. Quebec looks like they will determine whether its a majority or not?
[updated Sun Sep 28 14:02:03 EDT 2008]
28 Sep 14:02
2 replies so far. Join this conversationHide this conversation.
Phew! But Harper still has a 9 point lead. Methinks he or his party would have to do something monumentally stupid to blow it now. Or Bushco does, which spills across our once unguarded border.
The Liberals are going to be the official opposition. The only real question is whether or not we get a Tory majority. And what then?
Maybe we should draw up a "behavioural contract" for Harper. I'll do the first draft:
1. I promise not to get Canada into any more wars unless in self-defence, defence of an ally or as requested by the United Nations' Security Council to prevent genocide.
2. I promise to stop my rush to deregulate the private sector, whether competiton law, financial markets, environmental protection, labour standards or consumer protection.
3. I promise not to drag up resolved social issues, unless a specific campaign platform. These would include: a woman's right to choose, the death penalty, soft drugs, young offenders, the separation of church and state...
4. I promise to leave the wheat board, CBC, Canada Post and other Crown corporations alone.
5. I promise not to interfere with the legitimate duties of the the human rights, privacy access to information and official languages commissions.
6. I promise to stop muzzling government departments, so that they too can do their jobs.
You get my drift. Please feel free to add to the list.
[updated Sun Sep 28 14:28:12 EDT 2008]
28 Sep 14:28
116 replies so far. Join this conversationHide this conversation.
shk
Does Canadian constitution allow formation of Green and Lib coalition government ?
[updated Sun Sep 28 14:46:52 EDT 2008]
28 Sep 14:46
50 replies so far. Join this conversationHide this conversation.
Kelvin
Not surprising result: three-point Tory jump on Sept. 24 was clearly an outlier and has passed through the sample. NDP's stalled at 19% though.
[updated Sun Sep 28 15:02:28 EDT 2008]
28 Sep 15:02
1 reply so far. Join this conversationHide this conversation.
Foxer
Looks more like there was a sudden jump in the undecided - possibly people saying undecided instead of cpc - but it's very very odd that this is the second weekend in a row where there's a 'sudden and improbable' reversal.
The cpc dropping 2 points would be a little unusual - there's no indication of a sudden drop last night anywhere else. But more importantly, there's no reason for the libs to go way up while the ndp doesn't.
And that's the second weekend in a row that kind of thing has happened - sudden overnight drop for the cpc, sudden unexpected rise for the libs. And there's just no indication in any other poll that there was a reversal of that nature - in fact most would say the ndp has been gaining strength not the libs.
I dunno - we'll have to wait and see if it holds for a few days, if it 'suddenly' goes back up like we saw last week then i'm afraid we'll have to conclude there's a problem with nicks methods.
[updated Sun Sep 28 19:07:23 EDT 2008]
28 Sep 19:07
12 replies so far. Join this conversationHide this conversation.
MBAGS (suspended for inappropriate comments)
Hello boys and girls - MBAGS here !! Oh the shame of my posters to the 'Ottawa Valley Borden Line' blog that got over 200 'hits' so far. They are cryin' in their beer about now !! Geez, ONLY 9 points instead of 15 - OY VAY, what will they do !! No sleep tonight - late for work tomorrow !! LOL - NO majority !! Maybe worse !! One would hope this side of the 'Mason-Dixon' errr... Manitoba border !!
36% A SOLID weak minority and if it holds or gets worse, harper is D-E-D, dead !! LOL.
I CAN dream, but with the numbers taking a 'dive' I can't help but taking my turn to 'gloat' a little.
ALL the 'write-offs' and BANG, a 'Liberal surge'(I invented that one). It's a small one, but obviously at the cost to the cpc and harper's goonies. If we get another one like in '06 for the Libs, wow, we got a 'horse race'. Sorry to those whom I offend, but I've gotten my brains beat out about the 'Ottawa Valley Borden Line' from 1961-1973 and they're scattering for the hills out west after just long enough to take a 'poke' at me for daring to bring up the fact that Ontario saved their butts for 12 years !! LOL Cheers - MBAGS !!
BTW - If you want to 'Google' 'Ottawa valley Borden Line' (fourth one down), you Can read the truth about how many years Ontario supported Alberta's oil production at a huge cost - GRATIS !! Diefenbaker legislated it !! (PM for PCs - majority 1958-1963). I was almost 18 when the NOP took hold. I remember !! The Libs under Pearson and Trudeau let it go for Alberta until 1973 and it was cancelled, but Ontario payed, oh did we pay !!
[updated Sun Sep 28 20:30:44 EDT 2008]
28 Sep 20:30
54 replies so far. Join this conversationHide this conversation.
Foxer
You're a little weird aren't ya.
First off - these numbers would give him a stronger minority than he has now. Which is perfectly fine with the CPC and supporters - and is death to the libs and dion. So he's not 'ded' :)
BTW - if you google 'NEP' you can see how trudeau raped alberta till it's economy was in the tank.
And ontario took most of that money in loans, grants and benefits for it's industries.
And the borden affair was to benefit quebec, not alberta. :)
Sorry - the west has given far more to the east than the other way around. Seeing as you're as obscessed as those lunatics who think alberta pays all the bills now it was worth mentioning.
Ontario's problems are a result of ontario's mismanagment. It's benefited more from confederation than any other province other than quebec.
[updated Sun Sep 28 21:16:04 EDT 2008]
28 Sep 21:16
MBAGS (suspended for inappropriate comments)
36% is exactly what harper got in 2006. yes, Martin got 30% but it's coming up, for now, for Dion. At least, in my view, as long as harper only gets no more seats than before, he's done - a lOT more seats or he's done. the opposition could have more 'dippers' and fewer Libs, but the Libs would be the official opposition and the toal opposition would give harper no more if not less 'power' than he did before. Remember harper called an unnecessary election and if he doesn't 'produce' for the cpc, he's dead meat !! No large minority or majority and he's done.(IMHO). BTW - Dion's at 27% Layton at 19% with Nanos, the only one I trust.
[updated Sun Sep 28 22:41:39 EDT 2008]
28 Sep 22:41
Foxer
There is no chance harper is done if he wins the election, regardless of the seat count. And while dion's up today, his trend is down. A trend reflected in other polls. With the ndp up, harper will take more seats.
The CPC isn't the liberal party - we dont kick people out just because they don't win. But a minority is in fact a win. There is NO movement in the party to remove him if he doesn't get more seats.
And dion was pretty easy to push around the last time :) Harper will have about 2 years to push thru his next agenda, and still have time to crush the libs after. They will be even more broke than they are this time.
Nobody in the party wants him gone.
And i wouldn't get too excited about one blip in the polls :) just to let you know - with the ndp split the numbers as is still give harper more seats ;)
[updated Mon Sep 29 01:29:17 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 01:29
MBAGS (suspended for inappropriate comments)
Ontario has paid for the 'means' of every province in this confederation at one time or another. Right now it's being screwed even further than the Liberals did by harper.
BTW - 'foxer' - I would ask again about the $27,700 you 'propose' that my son can 'turn over' from his income to his wife. I requested that politely and very a-political. Tell me more. If what you say is true, it would help him quite a bit. Politics aside, I can't believe it's true, but if it is, I should be able to understand it and pas it on.
I will say - with Regards - Mark Baigrie(MBAGS).
[updated Sun Sep 28 23:01:39 EDT 2008]
28 Sep 23:01
Foxer
Ontario hasn't paid for the 'means' for any western provinces. Ever. Occasionally ottawa makes a small investment which is inevitably sucked backed 10 fold over time.
And ONLY if in doing so they win votes in ontario or quebec or both.
The railways and oil are classic examples.
And harper has done absolutely nothing to ontario - all the 'injustices' you mentioned came in under the liberals. In fact, harper has invested more money in ontario than the west and yet there's almost as many people in the west. So harper isn't 'screwing' anyone - the liberals did. Sorry if that's not working for you.
If you want to get the province back on track the solutions lie with your provincial govt' first and foremost. Harper can give your industries a little cash, but that won't do crap if you don't deal with the underlying problems.
About your son - i responded in your first thread. As i said, pm me if you like.
[updated Mon Sep 29 01:41:03 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 01:41
Lex Llewdor
Let's assume what you say is true. Ontario has propped up the west at tremendous expense.
So what? Read the constitution Trudeau gave us. Resource wealth isn't shared nationally.
Plus, it's not just resources that made Alberta rich. Saskatchewan has, undeniably, more resource wealth than Alberta, and only recently have they elected a government (Brad Wall's Saskatchewan Party) that gives them the business climate in which they can enjoy and benefit from that resource wealth.
Saskatchewan effectively sets the world price of both potash and uranium because they have all of the excess supply. Will you be complaining about Saskatchewan's wealth in the next election? Why do you hate success?
I'd also like to point out that the apparent weakness of the Canadian economy is almost entirely driven by Ontario's manufacturing sector, and Dion's carbon tax would only make that sector less profitable. Manufacturing is increibly energy intensive, and Dion would drive up the price of energy.
Unless you trust McGuinty to be charitable and sell you power at something lower than the going rate. Do you trust McGuinty that much?
[updated Mon Sep 29 12:23:58 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 12:23
MBAGS (suspended for inappropriate comments)
Your first paragraph is absolutely correct. The rest of your post is NOT relevant to this debate !!
[updated Mon Sep 29 13:02:38 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 13:02
KGirl
MBAGS:
Excellent. If Ontario is so well off and is already paying for the rest of the provinces, then you no longer are lusting after Alberta's fat transfer payments. What great news.
[updated Mon Sep 29 13:27:57 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 13:27
MBAGS (suspended for inappropriate comments)
Bad reply - I was(at 64 yrs of age) referring to ALL past years, long ago and NOT so long ago, when Ontario, with all of it's population, helped out EVERY province in Canada at one time or another.
NEVER has ANY province reciprocated, ESPECIALLY ALBERTA after the NOP from 1961-1973. Ontario helped them with their oil industry under legislation by the PCs under John Diefenbaker's majority gov't in 1961. Even the Liberal govt's of Pearson and Trudeau 'let it ride' for Alberta until 1973, when the NOP was cancelled.
What happened when Trudeau asked Alberta to reciprocate by helping their countrymen and women in 'bad times' vis-a-vis the 'oil embargo' by OPEC ??
Alberta (they wanted to quadruple the price of oil to their own countymen !!)flatly REFUSED !! What utter greed !! Trudeau then HAD to eventually bring in the NEP to MAKE Alberta help the country. What a bunch of BS from Alberta, would you say not ??(Yeah, I know. Don't ask proper Qs of a westerner - they are 'indoctrinated' to surely make a 'lie' out of it even when they know it's the TRUTH !!)
Check out 'Ottawa Valley Borden Line' on 'Google'(4th down). It explains how Ontario boosted Alberta for 12 years - GRATIS !!
[updated Mon Sep 29 17:50:54 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 17:50
MRM
I would have slept just fine with a nine point lead, much better than Stephane I suspect but now I will sleep even better:
Latest Polls:
Nanos 14 pt Tory lead
Harris Decima 11 pt Tory lead
Ipsos 16 pt Tory lead
Angus Reid 19 pt Tory lead
The Poll of Polls – 14 pt Tory lead
Tories lead in every region of the country except Que where they still have a six pt lead over the Liberals. They also have a six pt lead in ON.
All the polls are dated 27 or 28 Sept with the highest margin of error at 3.1%
Battleground numbers:
ON 13 pt Tory lead
BC 13 pt Tory lead
Que nine pt lead for the Bloc over the Tories who have a four pt lead over the Liberals.
The polls are dated 23 – 25 Sept so do not take into account the Tory gains indicated above.
Source CTV / G&M
SWEET DREAMS!!
[updated Sun Sep 28 21:22:14 EDT 2008]
28 Sep 21:22
MBAGS (suspended for inappropriate comments)
Have you seen the Nanos numbers for the 27th ??
cpc-36%
Lib27%
Ndp 19%
Grn 9%
Bq 9%
Your numbers are old and if they're NOT Nanos, I don't regard them at all.
[updated Sun Sep 28 22:26:39 EDT 2008]
28 Sep 22:26
westerner (suspended)
Gee that's terrible, only a 9 point lead! Understandable since the Liberals didn't get out of the starting gate until day 16 of the election race. It was part of their secret strategy to finish with a flurry.
[updated Sun Sep 28 22:34:27 EDT 2008]
28 Sep 22:34
MBAGS (suspended for inappropriate comments)
On Sept 20 and 21st with Nanos, the spread was 5 points. Go to nikonthenumbers.com and look at the numbers for the entire campaign. I only trust Nik Nanos - NO one else and always have been with him since he started.
BAGS
[updated Sun Sep 28 22:44:47 EDT 2008]
28 Sep 22:44
westerner (suspended)
Nik Nanos Poll results: On Sept. 23 spread was 11; on Sept 24 spread was 15, on Sept. 25 spread was 15, on Sept 26 spread was 14. I only trust Nik Nanos.
Strategic Counsel Poll is headed by Chretien's former Communications Director, Peter Donolo, and can't be trusted, although it showed a healthy lead by the Conservatives.
When are the Liberals going to get out of the starting gate and "crush" the Conservatives? (using your own words.)
[updated Sun Sep 28 23:54:30 EDT 2008]
28 Sep 23:54
MRM
parnel - The Nanos numbers for 27 Sept posted on the G&M site are Tories 39, Libs 25.
[updated Mon Sep 29 00:07:46 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 00:07
MBAGS (suspended for inappropriate comments)
Go to nikonthenumbers.com - That's where you get the most up to date Nanos poll. The 'nik' in the address is Nanos.
[updated Mon Sep 29 00:23:18 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 00:23
MBAGS (suspended for inappropriate comments)
MRM - The cpc or C.R.A.P. are NOT 'Tories'. They were decimated in 1993 and shortly revived in the next election. peter mckay put the final 'nail' in the 'coffin' of the TRUE 'Tories' by going with harper when he swore he would NEVER do it.
The craps are NOT 'Tories - period and they are NOT even close to being 'conservative' either. They stole that name and are a disgrace to it's foundations. Sir John A. would be 'turning in his grave' !!
[updated Mon Sep 29 00:30:01 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 00:30
MBAGS (suspended for inappropriate comments)
G&M may say that, but it's NOT true. Is it a western based company - G&M ?? I guess they are day late and a dollar short !! LOL
[updated Mon Sep 29 00:32:04 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 00:32
MRM
parnel - Sorry you don't get to decide who is a Tory and who isn't. You get to console all of your Liberal loser friends on 15 Oct.
G&M western? Yeah maybe west of Montreal in a little place called TORONTO you [EDITED BY MODERATOR].
[updated Mon Sep 29 00:55:12 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 00:55
Is Parnel = MBAGS. Is that established? Can't be,
[updated Mon Sep 29 01:54:41 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 01:54
TPQ (suspended for inappropriate comments)
rsharp I'm still here. I have been travelling this past week and was able to avoid the mutt and jeff propaganda show
[updated Mon Sep 29 03:55:21 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 03:55
westerner (suspended)
Parnel morphed into TPQ and then to MBAGS. It was suggested to him that if he blogged under both MBAGS and TPQ at the same time his cover would be much better. He is doing that now. The bluster and fantasy is too much to cover up.
[updated Mon Sep 29 11:13:04 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 11:13
Parnel, TPQ and MBAGS, is this true? MRM, Foxer and westerner, are you a conspiracy?
[updated Mon Sep 29 11:17:52 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 11:17
westerner (suspended)
I don't know Foxer or MRM. Foxer seems to be from BC; not sure of MRM. Changing tags seems like an interesting strategy! Wonder if I could change my language enough not to be recognized. MBAGS didn't come close to covering up.
[updated Mon Sep 29 11:45:33 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 11:45
He's not confessed yet, to my knowledge. On another of your posts, you may be right about door-knocking being a better use of time than blogging during an election. It's just so.... you know.... old style. Like western movies!
[updated Mon Sep 29 11:58:43 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 11:58
westerner (suspended)
Door knocking, with the candidate, is the most effective campaigning or so I'm told by experienced people who know.
[updated Mon Sep 29 16:18:26 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 16:18
MBAGS (suspended for inappropriate comments)
Nanos poll for Sept 27th - spread 9 points
[updated Mon Sep 29 00:21:43 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 00:21
So your contention is the 1 Poll only to make your assesment of the Liberal turnaround?
[updated Mon Sep 29 10:09:15 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 10:09
MBAGS (suspended for inappropriate comments)
I have a right to take a good feeling from a poll showing the cpc falling and the Liberals gaining. It happened on Sept 20 and 21st. Hopefully this time it will hold for the Liberals and get better over time. Rememeber(if you can) in '06, the Liberals came back very strong in the last few days of the campaign. There is NO reason it can't happen again. The TRUE Liberals 'stay with the party' when it comes time to vote. We seldom change our minds and are loyal to the party and don't 'shop around' like others do. If a philosophy works over time, it has to be a good one. I have NO time for people who 'change their stripes' virtually every election. Loyalty IS a good quality. I WILL say, however, that a 'mongrel' party such as the cpc with a dictator for a leader has NO standing in Canadian politics IMHO. Therefore I HAVE to discount them on the 'loyalty' factor. They are a 'regional party' with NO aspirations for helping the east and as I have said, anyone who votes for the cpc east of the Manitoba border is wasting their votes and helping to ruin this country, especially Ontario.
[updated Mon Sep 29 11:05:43 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 11:05
MBAGS (suspended for inappropriate comments)
27th - nanos poll cpc-36% Lib 27% Ndp - 19%
[updated Mon Sep 29 00:36:07 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 00:36
MRM
Keep clinging to this parnel. It is all you and your party have left.
[updated Mon Sep 29 00:56:15 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 00:56
TPQ (suspended for inappropriate comments)
Is this all you have left? Probably so since the cons have no policies to offer and their voters accept sleaze as the modus operandi. There will be no Harper majority and possibly no Harper win. The Libs are a lot closer, and in a position to make that final run, than your big mouth will ever allow.
At least rsharp has some passion, a mind of his own and some ideas other than quoting useless trivia and attack dog stuff as the mutt and jeff team do.
[updated Mon Sep 29 04:00:49 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 04:00
MRM
Hi TPQ, welcome back. I would say that we missed you but we had your alter ego filling in for you.
Nope, that’s not all I got, how’s CTV New’s lead story?
“Majority movement gains speed as Harper's lead soars”
Globe and Mail Update September 28, 2008 at 9:14 PM EDT
CTV/G&M Poll of Polls Tories 38, Libs 24
What have you got again? Oh yeah there’s this:
“Low expectations for Dion in televised debates: Poll” (CTV News)
[updated Mon Sep 29 08:18:47 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 08:18
Are you basing your statement on this one poll and ignoring all others?
Where are you getting your information from to claim the Liberals trends are turning around?
Thanks
[updated Mon Sep 29 09:50:44 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 09:50
westerner (suspended)
Hi MBAGS!! You are still responding as TPQ? It doesn't matter what tag you us, your stuff is still fantasy and non factual.
[updated Mon Sep 29 11:03:48 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 11:03
rofl
[updated Mon Sep 29 09:41:07 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 09:41
Again your idea of debate is to refer to people and idealogy that are not yours as extremist and goons. Its a shame you can't keep your bias from clouding your argument. It clouds your judgement and reflects a closed mind.
I am open to looking at different platforms and ideas and will not attack others who don't agree.
[updated Mon Sep 29 08:50:37 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 08:50
MBAGS (suspended for inappropriate comments)
I've been getting plenty of it from 'the dark side' and give it back 'in kind'.
[updated Mon Sep 29 09:30:25 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 09:30
I enjoy satire and comedy like everyone else but I admire all people from all parties who have run for gov't and tried to make a difference. I do give people the benefit of being sincere and I try to limit my personal bias keeping me from making informed decisions without reviewing all the information. I wish you well in your pursuit of knowledge.
[updated Mon Sep 29 09:45:58 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 09:45
MBAGS (suspended for inappropriate comments)
My pursuit of 'knowledge' about politics in Canada has found me firmly entrenched in the Liberal philosophy. At 64 years of age, I have found this comforting that I am a member of the most prolific party at forming govt's this country has ever seen. It has also produced the 'best of times' where most, if not ALL others have either floundered at it or simply didn't have the wherewithall politically to handle it. THAT 'notion' is absolutely prevalent with harper and his cpc party, born of distrust of each other with having just one goal - power at the expense of anyone who would dare to speak against them. It DOES NOT have a country-wide 'goal' for a federal party. It's BASE is in the west solely and it will pander to western values while the fools who vote for harper east of the Manitoba border waste their votes. He will NEVER help them, especially Ontario !!
[updated Mon Sep 29 10:47:38 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 10:47
So basically you paint yourself as an "extremist" who will adopt a single party's platform regardless of policy or ideas presented by other parties. I have voted for all parties and their platforms best reflecting the values of working families.
You also label anyone who does not share your personal views as foolish.
Your claims to speak on behalf of Canadians who dont share your views and prefer to devalue Canadians who live in Western Canada speaks to your limited capacity to understand a balanced debate.
I live in Ontario, and all Canadians are entitled to express and vote accordingly, to target Canadians who live in the west as less Canadian because they don't or share your value reminds me of statements of labels used by people "Neo-cons, fascist".. etc.
It would be comical if your belief was a satire on tv, unfortunately its your own beliefs and bias that reflect your limited knowledge of history and our great country.
From "..coast to coast"... we are Canadian.
Goodluck with your views and I am glad we are better than that.
No single party has a "birth-right" to form the government but must earn it as reflected in our history.
[updated Mon Sep 29 11:07:54 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 11:07
MBAGS (suspended for inappropriate comments)
The 'extremists' are the cpc and harper. I can't understand what you are getting at. You're obciously young and can be 'manipulated' by such a man has harper.
To call a Canadian an extemist who has always voted for the longest-standing honest party in this confederation(with a few 'bumps') is ridiculous. The cpc is a 'new' brand and it NEEDS a 'recall' and soon.
[updated Mon Sep 29 11:15:45 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 11:15
Look at the Leaderboard who opinions are measured by the users of this forum. Read the notes below they may suprise you.
Loyalty is a wonderful trait but to believe we must accept your views of this country or idealogy is not a question of loyalty.
It is called an "extreme" or "blind faith" position:look up terms like "fascists, neo-conservative" they all hold that their idealogy in the only "true" viewpoint.
Unfortunately you are a victim of that "mental paralysis".
Goodluck and October 14, 2008 results are correct.
[updated Mon Sep 29 11:29:27 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 11:29
MBAGS (suspended for inappropriate comments)
You insult me as a 64 year old man who has 'seen it all'. The 'fascist' and 'neo-conservative' label I WOULD put on harper. He's a former member of 'Northern Foundation' which definitely has fascist 'roots'. They are also anti-women's rights.
[updated Mon Sep 29 11:36:02 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 11:36
I have not insulted you in fact I have asked you to provide this forum with some balance and leave your bias behind.
You have attacked Canadians who dont hold your view.
You have insulted Canadians throughout your posts, I have asked you to look up the definitions of "extremist" as your inability to accept other ideas is similar.
Whether you are 2 years old or 64 yrs old, civility and good manners in this forum are required for purposes of debate and sharing of ideas.
You have no interest in debate but you continually demean any viewpoint that is not yours.
[updated Mon Sep 29 11:43:24 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 11:43
MBAGS (suspended for inappropriate comments)
Right back at you, my 'indoctrinated' friend. When more Liberals find this site, we shall have a 'battle royal' and then that will be fair. Until then, go away and play with your x-box. I've got grandkids to visit and at least one of them is probably older than you are !!
[updated Mon Sep 29 11:49:15 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 11:49
You will be ignored as you have not raised an intelligible point of debate or fact besides hateful ideas of your bias throughout your spin in this forum.
Goodluck with your grandson and I hope they grow up respecting different views and dont make personal attacks blindly.
[updated Mon Sep 29 12:22:06 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 12:22
MBAGS (suspended for inappropriate comments)
I introduced 'Ottawa Valley Borden Line' and you cpcers went nut. Came up with ALL kinds of unfounded comments about how it wasn't as the link I gave said it was.
[updated Mon Sep 29 13:00:33 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 13:00
Caliban
MBAGS, I'm a recent arrival and missed the 'Ottawa Valley Border Line' reference. I hope it isn't out of place to ask here what that's about.
[updated Mon Sep 29 14:27:41 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 14:27
Good luck with trying to reason with him into discussing anything without insults. I have given up as he has already made up his mind on all issues and anyone who does NOT share his views are foolish.
[updated Mon Sep 29 14:43:24 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 14:43
Caliban
Thanks. Not to worry, I found the link.
[updated Mon Sep 29 16:46:34 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 16:46
MBAGS (suspended for inappropriate comments)
'Caliban'(are you sure ??) - 'Google' 'Ottawa Valley Borden Line' - 4th line down. It tells the story of 12 years of Ontario's paying double the world price for Alberta's oil to help them with the production of their oil. It's quite a story.
[updated Mon Sep 29 17:54:28 EDT 2008]
29 Sep 17:54
MRM
To para phrase your own words. That was back in the 60s so who cares?
[updated Wed Oct 01 01:20:33 EDT 2008]
01 Oct 01:20
TPQ (suspended for inappropriate comments)
And what do you bring to the table?
[updated Wed Oct 01 03:19:06 EDT 2008]
01 Oct 03:19