The election decision currently lies in the hands of either Stephen Harper and Stephane Dion. Looking at the numbers, calling an election is fraught with risks for them both. Our latest tracking shows a statistical tie between the federal Liberals (33%) and the Conservatives (31%). And support for the Harper Conservatives has marginally slipped in the past 90 days. Conversely, the Layton New Democrats have slowly regained ground over the past three waves of Nanos tracking.
The Liberals lead in Ontario and Atlantic Canada, while the Tories continue to lead in the West. In the province of Quebec, the Bloc is ahead of both the Liberals and the Conservatives, who are locked in a statistical tie.
Of note, Nanos tracking indicates that the level of comfort with the idea of a Harper majority, although still solid, has declined compared to a year ago.
Even though the Harper Tories have been merciless in their attacks on Stephane Dion, these attacks have not, over the past year yielded any political dividends in public opinion for the Tories. The reality is that the Tories are not fighting Dion…they are fighting the Liberal brand. In vote rich Ontario and also in Atlantic Canada, the Conservatives have never been able to surpass the Liberals in popular support over the past two years. Think of the risks for Harper….a likely spring offensive in Afghanistan (every spring the Taliban have launched an offensive) increases the possibility of casualties and the demand for clarity on Afghanistan from both Harper and Dion.
Then there’s the economy. If the Canadian economy does slide, the Tories will likely be better served by going to the polls in the Spring – ahead of a potential downturn. For the Liberals, the challenge is Quebec where Dion has not been embraced by Quebecers and the Liberals still suffer from post-adscam syndrome. Any improvement in Liberal fortunes in Quebec denies the Tories a majority and election will be up for grabs.
I can understand why Layton, Duccepe and May want an election. Harper and Dion’s enthusiasm is harder to understand based on the numbers and the likely environment for a potential Spring election.
Methodology
Polling between February 2nd and February 4th, 2008. (Random Telephone Survey of 1002 Canadians, 18 years of age and older). The Nanos Research Survey of 1,002 Canadians is accurate to within 3.1 percentage points, plus or minus, 19 times out of 20. The subset of committed voters is accurate to within 3.4 percentage points, plus or minus, 19 times out of 20. Percentages may not add up to 100 due to rounding. The numbers in parenthesis denotes the change from the previous Nanos Research Survey completed in November, 2007.
Question: For those parties you would consider voting for federally, could you please rank your top two current local preferences? (Committed Voters Only - First Choice)
Canada (N=841, MoE ± 3.4%, 19 times out of 20)
- Liberal Party 33% (-1)
- Conservative Party 31% (-4)
- NDP 19% (+2)
- BQ 10% (+1)
- Green Party 8% (+2)
Ontario (N=250, MoE ± 6.4%, 19 times out of 20)
- Liberal Party 43% (NC)
- Conservative Party 31% (-1)
- NDP 19% (NC)
- Green Party 7% (+1)
Quebec (N=217, MoE ± 6.7%, 19 times out of 20)
- BQ 37%(+4)
- Conservative Party 23% (-6)
- Liberal Party 22% (-1)
- NDP 12% (+1)
- Green Party 6% (+3)
Question: As you may know, the Conservative Party led by Stephen Harper is a minority government. Based on what you know and have seen about Stephen Harper and the Conservative government’s record so far, would you be comfortable, somewhat comfortable, somewhat uncomfortable or uncomfortable with the Stephen Harper-led Conservatives potentially winning the next election and forming a majority government?
The numbers in parenthesis denotes the change from the previous Nanos Research Survey completed in April, 2007
- Comfortable 29% (-4)
- Somewhat comfortable 24% (+3)
- Somewhat uncomfortable 17% (+2)
- Uncomfortable 28% (+1)
- Unsure 4% (NC)
So….how do you feel about having a federal election? Who do you think would/could/will win a federal election if it occurred this spring?
Cheers,
NJN
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Most Read Comments
Highest Rated Comments
Well, Nik, I believe I have an equally reliable predictor for the Canadian polit... more
Tom Good (British Columbia) 08 Feb 01:44
Nik: Ever since you mentioned in your interview with Mike Duffy on Wednesday ... more
Gordo05 (Newfoundland and Labrador) 08 Feb 08:08
I am not surprised to see the apparent drop in Conservative support. Each day th... more
hollinm (Saskatchewan) 08 Feb 11:11
I agree that Harper should have given Ontario all the seats to which it is entit... more
RonaldODowd (Ontario) 24 Feb 02:57
You mention fundraising as an indicator of support for the Conservatives. Howev... more
broughad (Ontario) 09 Feb 00:26
I got to give you that one Martin did not do well as Prime Minister. He was turf... more
Mike (Québec) 09 Feb 19:45
Comments
Tom Good
Well, Nik, I believe I have an equally reliable predictor for the Canadian political scene. Unfortunately, one chicken sacrificed itself for the greater good and the entrails foretold the future amid the blood and the stink. Nothing will change for the first part of the year. Stephen will get his way and Stephane will "bow to his caucus"-----Obviously, the two great political leaders are only doing this for the greater good of Canadians, as it should be, and voting numbers have absolutely nothing to do with those decisions, as it should be. Ho Ho
[updated Fri Feb 08 01:44:39 EST 2008]
08 Feb 01:44
5 replies so far. Join this conversationHide this conversation.
blossom
Hi Tom,
Good show!
I say that we shall probably see two provincial elections before a Federal election is called.I would even predict that 2009 is going to be the year already determined.
The Grits need to gain four Liberal ridings.
The Afghan question is going to be ongoing, at least until 2011.
It's the same old scenario...we have witnessed that it really works for all parties. They finally all save face, and keep the momentum going. Ha Ha
[updated Sat Feb 09 00:25:50 EST 2008]
09 Feb 00:25
Tom Good
Hey, Blossom, and who pays for all this political theatre ! ! !
[updated Sat Feb 09 05:17:25 EST 2008]
09 Feb 05:17
calmecam
Sadly, all of us as Canadians pay, but not only in terms of money. Our political system has been infected with American-style hyper-partisanship, and as such, with more and more of us tuning out of the process... democracy and informed debate are the biggest casualties. There's just no credibility left in the system.
[updated Mon Feb 18 15:06:43 EST 2008]
18 Feb 15:06
Tom Good
Hello Calmecam: You are so right---all principles or the principled stand have been thrown out the window as each party massages the bottle containing the vote-count geni. Politics are quite debased today but we must not turn away in disgust otherwise we may well get what we do not want----that is the high price of indifference.
Last night I saw a partial preview of a Conservative attack campaign video clip---quite a dishonest manipulation but who said politics were clean? When the election call comes, it is going to be a mighty dirty campaign along the American lines----regrettable.
[updated Mon Feb 18 16:40:24 EST 2008]
18 Feb 16:40
calmecam
Thanks for your comment Tom!
I have a slightly different perspective.
I think that the Conservatives will run an American Republic-style dirty campaign, but that the Liberals will run an entirely different style of campaign.
There will be tone and counter-tone in the coming election with the Conservatives screaming their hyperbole louder and louder (as if saying the same thing over again louder makes us believe it more) and the Liberals showing a greener and more generous Canada.
There'll be spin all-around, but one style will be more appealing in the end.
[updated Mon Feb 18 17:41:35 EST 2008]
18 Feb 17:41
Gordo05
Nik:
Ever since you mentioned in your interview with Mike Duffy on Wednesday night that Nanos Research has new numbers, I have been eagerly awaiting their release. Wow! As Sir Walter Scott wrote - "What a tangled web we weave. When first we practice to deceive." The BIG question that hits me from these numbers is why we have been hearing the beating of the election drums on Parliament Hill - with the steady drum rolls coming from the Conservatives. My guess is that the Conservatives have been looking closely at Dion and have decided that - perhaps based on their own polling where they have dug deeper into the leadership issue - that Dion is vulnerable, and in the heat of an election campaign he will literally melt under the pressure... so they want to go now before the economy tanks. I can't recall a time in Canadian politics when we have been so polarized for so long without any political party showing any clear lead. The Conservatives had their chance back in May of 2007, but blew it - perhaps they thought their numbers would get better - into the mid-40s, but they lost that momentum and now they look like they are less of an option than the Liberals. If I can offer somewhat of a crass assessment, I think the Conservatives are in deep, deep trouble because, while they have held on to their constituency in the West, they have made no inroads at all in Ontario. They are not really setting the house on fire in Quebec either. So, will there be an election this Spring? These numbers would indicate that there won't. In my view, the ball is clearly in Dion's court. Will he put his backpack on and go home - or will he rally his team and go for a three-pointer? When we sift through these numbers, it really is up to him, isn't it.
[updated Fri Feb 08 08:08:00 EST 2008]
08 Feb 08:08
61 replies so far. Join this conversationHide this conversation.
blossom
I am back Gordo05,
As Sir Walter Scott, or is it Raleigh so said: "My Native Land"
Breathes there the man with soul so dead, whose heart had near'd within him burned...
The PM has lost it, and I am anxious to see how he intends cow-towing with Qc in his budget this year...It could be that we also have to go back to the polls within the year again, again, and again....
Another moot point - The PM is from Ontario, and not from Alberta as is his better half. I often hear, in this Province of Qc, - Steve Who? Oh you mean the guy who's taking his orders from "bush"....,
Your assessment is not crass; just stating the obvious.
I think that I should stop now - I promised never to be mean! I haven't even yet tasted the wine...
[updated Fri Feb 08 23:12:35 EST 2008]
08 Feb 23:12
blossom
Hello Gordo05,
I thought that I had already responded to your post.
I always commend Nik for being truly professional, however, Nik stated that his polling numbers were already (stale), i.e. prior to the Manley Commission, or something?
Last week it was definately "election frenzy", but the medias seem to be begging for this?
Today's ;news was that Mr. Harper was in Qc and that he might pick-up many more seats...Don't you believe it! People who were interviewed stated that they were there because first and foremost; it was a "free" breakfast...
In Qc. one never knows where the pin falls...The adq will no longer be the opposition, and the pq is broke and ruffling a lot of feathers!
Does one really believe that we are going to have a Federal election, Prov. in Alberta where the Grits are showing well, and a possible election out here...NO!
From past experience, the parties will agree to disagree, re-shuffle the cards, and all will fall into place. Right now, no party would benefit from an early, unwanted election; except that when Canadians realize perhaps next Fall that their toes are being somewhat stubbed; they will remember at the polls.
M. Dion is ready for any eventuality, but will not compromise his Leadership, call an election that Canadians do not want, and especially fall into Mr. Harper's election traps...
If one is fair, one has to agree that M. Dion's first year as Opposition Leader was not easy, and that Mr. Harper's attack ads were unrelentless, and Canadians did not know him, and he had been badgered in his own Province for the :Clarity Act. The Liberal party was divided from within, and out of funds.
I shall grant you that the PM shows well, but when it comes to the facts; M. Dion has proved that he can delve deep within policies, and his arguments are strong. I watched during the Leadership Candidate Race, and you can believe me that you can take anything he states as "cash to the bank".
I think that we shall be seeing many more concessions but if M. Dion can hold himself back from falling into all of the pitfalls thrown at him, that his numbers will grow astonishingly. Only a loser wants to throw away his chances! One has to take it in stride, and see the broad picture, and take the longterm view.
The pitfall has been defining who looks more prime-minestarial, rather than looking deep down into the issues and policies. This is what defines a Leader from somebody who wants votes.
I don't think that we differ on any of this, except that your doubts seem to be about an unknown Leader who never got his honeymoon???
I still state, and you are absolutely right, that Mr. Harper as much as he tried to get a majority did not obtain it, and even when you thought that the time was ripe - this is where I disagree. He got his chance, got elected on his 5 platform issues, which did not have much substance. This is what defined his career. It is possible that Mr. Harper will get what he's been asking for, but there's an old saying "Be careful what you wish for"!
All in all, woman are more recalcitrant to an authoritarian PM. as the polls have also shown, and M. Dion offers an alternative!
My quote just got a little bit altered...I din't have it in sight, but I thought that it fit the purpose.
My hunch is that "no" election for now - not until the economy softens, and with election fever in the US, Canadians will want to see how that develops. We just might learn something. And I also agree with you that the state of our "Economy" will be the clincher to call an election.
[updated Sun Feb 10 00:03:15 EST 2008]
10 Feb 00:03
Gordo05
There's a great column in today's Montreal Gazette by commentator L. Ian MacDonald entitled "Harper should be careful what he wishes for: Recent polls indicate the Liberals could form the next minority government." It is so reflective of the way I am feeling on this issue that I decided to cut and paste most of it here. My apologies if you have already read it. But I thought others would be interested as well... I've had to do some editing, as it goes beyond the total permitted on this site (5000 characters). So here goes:
Stephen Harper appears to be stage-managing the defeat of his minority government in the House. In offering the opposition three different confidence issues in the next two months - Afghanistan, the budget and the crime bill - he's daring them to combine on at least one of them to bring down the government.
Of the three, only the budget - due in late February for a vote in early March - is an automatic question of confidence. But in tabling the resolution on extending the Afghanistan mission, government House leader Peter Van Loan declared, as expected, that it would also be a confidence issue. For good measure, the government is throwing in a vote on the crime bill as a confidence question, in the event it doesn't clear the Liberal-dominated Senate by the end of this month.
The last one, the crime bill, is pure mischief-making on Harper's part, taunting Stéphane Dion. As it happens, both the NDP and the Bloc Québécois are likely to support the government on this one, since neither party is a big fan of the Senate.
As for the Afghan motion, it might not be the trigger for an election in that the Liberals are divided on this issue and don't want to go to the country on it. They could end up forcing an election on the budget, instead.
But Harper, for his part, should beware what he wishes for. April, with an election, could turn out to be the cruelest month.
Indeed, a new Nanos poll suggests there is not only every reason for Harper to reflect seriously on forcing his defeat in the House, but every good reason to avoid it.
Nik Nanos is the pollster who called every party's result in 2006 to within one-tenth of one percentage of the outcome, which set a new standard for accuracy in measuring public opinion.
From three days in the field last week, Nanos found the Liberals moving ahead of the Conservatives 33 to 31 per cent, and the NDP at 19 per cent nationally.
In Quebec, Nanos saw the Bloc at 37 per cent (up four points in two months), the Conservatives at 23 per cent (down six), and the Liberals at 22 per cent (down one). While regional breakouts leave room for twice the margin of error (six points as opposed to three), Nanos is basically in line with the previous week's authoritative CROP poll, which saw the Bloc at 36 per cent, the Conservatives at 27 per cent and the Liberals at 21 per cent in Quebec. The CROP numbers would give the Conservatives only the 11 Quebec seats they have now, the Nanos poll would give them even fewer.
The Conservatives are looking at even worse numbers in Ontario, where the Liberals lead 43 to 31 per cent, with the NDP at 19 per cent. For the Tories, this isn't even 2006 all over again, when their 35 per cent produced 40 Ontario seats; but more like 2004, when their 30 per cent resulted in only 24 seats, with the Tories virtually shut out in Toronto's suburban 905 belt.
Harper still has much stronger leadership numbers than Dion, but not the huge advantage he enjoyed a year ago. For example, on the key attribute of competence, Harper leads Dion 39-16; on trust 30-14, and on vision, 32-17.
Those are still 2-1 margins, but not enough for wise heads to overlook voting intention. On that, the Nanos poll is clear. There is no majority for anyone, and quite possibly a Liberal minority produced by Ontario.
Tactics and brinksmanship are all very well in the House. But if Harper means to go to the country, he needs much better numbers than this in his pocket.
[updated Mon Feb 11 14:41:44 EST 2008]
11 Feb 14:41
blossom
Hello Gordo05.
In one of my latest posts this is exactly what I said; that Mr. Harper better be careful what he wishes for!!!
Politically, we are on the same wavelength. Ian J. MacDonald was Mr. Mulroney's official speechwriter. Yes, I do read him occasionally, but Craid Oliver of CTV rarely has it wrong.
Mr. Harper from the start wanted to ignite volcanoes to go to the polls; as I have always predicted he will never attain a majority...I state that he cannot even get a 'minority'...He might get that election which he craves for, but won't get what he hopes for.
The only logical solution, and M. Dion stated with passion, determination, and wants to make logical amendments and bring solutions so that we don't stagnate in Afghanistan without a plan...2009 - will be extented for 2011, without chasing after combat. This Nato led compact mission will last 'till 2011, and Mr. Harper is responsible for having made this issue one of political games, not telling the truth about the mission and how bad it was getting out there, and that our soldiers need to train the "national polic
Mr. Harper secretly met Premier J. Charest this week-end??? Another silent, mysterious mission. Still trying to get votes!
The Crime Bill is already approved at 4/5...The Senate, that both the harpercrites, and ndp want to get rid of, have had this Bill for 9 days only to review.This Bill would have been passed had Mr. Harper not progated Parliament after Xmas. It was repetitios of last Fall.
Mr. Harper declared that we would have elections in 2009; now he wants to self-defeat before the designated date.
Why aren't we seeing Mr. Harper this week? Is he still docile? He's not following the Manley report that he called!
Minister Jim Flaherty has already told us what to expect - they have given it all away.
J. Charest wants 2.- some billion dollars for the manufacturing and forestry sector, both for Qc., and Ontario.
If I heard correctly Mr. Flaherty thinks that all that can be done for any eventuality with the forth-coming crunch in the Economy has already been done. Not so my friend; not if we are paying attention to the US economy that will drive this home next summer.
Aghanistan should not be a politial issue. This is a war, and should be debated until we all know where we stand. We must be assured of finding other allies.
I agreed with Nik said on CTV yesterday, except that Dion is proving the Leader I hoped that he would be; give him a little bit more time and experience - he is learning the ropes. And I disagree Nik, about the Grits gaining a minority, but they will achieve a small majority.
Since the 'bloq', the party that sees to nationalists' interests, is helping Harper. Some are even calling that they are no longer needed.
If the Liberals win Alberta, and Qc calls an election; this voter fatigue will be imminent.
The Crime Bill is not an election call. The Senators will give a full, extra week, and will amend the Bill. If an election, it would go until 2009. Harper's base wouldn't appreciate this.
Jim Flaherty has already prepared us not to expect much; in the budget since he's already blown it away.
I don't know if you have noticed, but it is getting pretty mean in the House!!!Nothing new, but the points are coming across finally.
Gamesmanship: Since when does a monority party with so few priorities, call a vote of confidence on each issue. I find it insulting to our own Parliamentary system.
I predict that this week we shall see some unforeseen developments, and that this will open a few can of worms. If one plays with fire, one can get burned!
To me, it is obvious that the PM has lost it!
Canadians do not want an election - They want Parliament to function, and the cost of this election will backfire on Mr. Harper, because he is calling the shots!
My feeling is that they do not want to cope with what is coming, and would rather bow out by pushing an election down our throats.
In essense we agree, Gordo05, Anything but this present govt.
Cheers,
[updated Tue Feb 12 01:51:48 EST 2008]
12 Feb 01:51
Gordo05
Blossom:
I spent the evening in front of the TV watching Mike Duffy Live - CPAC and NewsWorld. All were bopping back and forth with various political spokesthingys (as Frank Magazine calls them) on the various scenarios being played out. The Conservatives look so stupid on this Crime Bill thing with the Senate even Duffy was taking strips off Tory MP Rob Moore right to his face. The $64,000 question here is why Harper wants to go to the polls now. I don't understand it. The National Post is reporting today that Harper is prepared to ask the Governor General to pull the plug on the minority Parliament and trigger a spring election if the Senate does not pass the government's violent-crime bill by March 1. But some constitutional experts say such a move would conflict with a federal law passed last year setting fixed-election dates. Under the law, which was introduced by the Harper government, the next federal election is slated for October, 2009, unless the opposition parties defeat the government before then. Constitutional expert Erroll Mendes says in the same article that "One could make a very strong argument to the Governor General to refuse his request because he's violating his own law." Mendes is a professor of constitutional and international law at the University of Ottawa. He said that an attempt to force an election would also violate the constitutional principle of Senate independence. He said the Commons has no authority to compel the Senate to pass legislation. Tory heavy-weight Peter Van Loan (sorry Peter, but if the shoe fits...) has said the fixed-election law doesn't prevent the prime minister from asking the Governor General to dissolve Parliament. The Conservative House leader is quoted as saying "There is nothing in the law that takes away the Crown's traditional and usual prerogatives on this matter." He said this at a news conference when he announce the motion last week. The motion will be put to a vote as early as today, and is expected to pass. If the Senate then refuses to pass the bill by March 1, the two chambers of Parliament would be at a "clear impasse," Van Loan said last week. Someone made a point either in this chat area or in response to a story on CTV or CBC - I read so much online stuff I don't recall where I saw this - but the person made a comment that every time Peter Van Loan lies, his left eyebrow touches his hairline... I kept thinking about that when he was on the various channels last night, and believe me, his eyebrow twitched a lot. So, Blossom, it looks like you and I and the rest of Canada will be plunged into a federal election within the next few weeks. By the way, I joined the Liberal Party of Canada this week. Seems like a bargain to me - only $5. I'll be able to vote at the candidate selection meeting in my riding. A former colleague of mine is running for the Liberal nomination, so I think I'll support her. May even volunteer to work for her if she wins the nomination. She is a good choice, as she is an accomplished businesswoman, a former president of the local board of trade, and I "media-trained" her about 20 years ago when she worked for one of our local credit unions. I think the Liberals will emerge united under the Afghanistan amendments they have hammered out and M. Dion is beginning to look like the stateman he is - not the poor leader demonized by the Conservatives in their attack ads. After all, they are "attack" ads and I think the Canadian people are fed up with the "bs" from the Conservatives and Harper, and are looking for someone with principles. Dion is no Barack Obama - but he's good enough for me.
[updated Tue Feb 12 09:30:00 EST 2008]
12 Feb 09:30
blossom
Hello Gordo05,
How well I understand you...Think about it...
Mr. Harper in his platform campaign stated that he would do away with the vastly Liberal Senate. Elected a Conservative Senator. (Forget his name). Most Canadians aren't even interested with the Senate. (Distraction).
Mr. Harper said that he liked his job, and wanted to keep it, and he obviously meant it - He will for a little while yet. Election feaver...(distraction).
Mr. Harper cannot give a vote of confidence to the Senate, re. Crime Bill already 4/5ths accepted. (Distraction).
I have asked what happens if he goes to the Gov. General and asks to bring down his gov/t. at his own request? Madame Jean is pretty smart, (don't know which party she votes for in Qc), but does our Constitution permit her to respond -
NO? No one is asking to bring down the present gov/t, and at what costs, etc...Just a thought! I would love to see a first, and Mme Jean react and say that Canadians do not want to spend for an election, and go back to your office ,and do what Canadians ask of you, when you asked them to vote for you!!!
Hey, I just finished reading the rest of your post...WOW...Welcome to the club. This is exciting news, and what made you join? I mean what triggered this sudden leap?
Okay, I just listened to Obama this evening, and this reminds me of the old US of A that I so loved! The reason that Hillary is losing is that whilst she realized that she was losing those States, she headed for the bigger stakes - Texas...totally ignoring the electorate that would vote for Obama. Now Hillary claims that she will be Commander in Chief, rather than President. I guess this virus is catchy!
The time has come to reshape our civil societies as John Saul stated, and that with Globalization that we stood up to the plate, in the words of Obama, and Stephane Dion. As Eisenhower had warned; "beware of the industrial complex".
It is time that we created and innovated. Civility, principles, values, Education, Scientists and mathematicians that can, at least, cope, if not compete. We seem to have forgotten our goals and ideals for the future, and have become blind to the hopes and aspirations that our grandparents had. Canada is a Country of innovators and inventors.
There is good news in my province today. Mme St-Pierre has announced her upcoming budget, and it seems that our Provincial Liberals will avoid another election.
What I like about Obama and Dion is that they are trying to take us to another level of intellectual development. Obama's message of "Hope" is better than the conservative message of "fear and prevail". We shall have huge environmental problems to cope with, and we had better get our act together. Obama is sweeping the more educated. We have to get used to a knew developing technological world, whereby the "sky is the sky is the new technological complex.".
The cheap political games that we have witnessed these last two years have waisted time and money, and are pre-historic. I hope that we all get on the band-wagon and choose Leaders because of their policies, rather than their looks.
It is getting so that the parcel is the gift, and most expensive, rather than the content...The markets have benefitted from this wisdom. Give me some substance!
If you can, try to meet M. Dion in person. You will understand what I mean. You will understand the big picture. He has an intelligent, and engaging look in those sparkling eyes, and a winsome smile.
Did you see him Sunday with JaneTaber...M. Dion did not let her interupt him, when rudily interupted, pursued his message, faced the audience and was talking on a one to one with his audience, and finessed with clear understanding, the Afghanistan issue.
We are all fed-up with the old rhetoric.
So happy to have you on board.
[updated Tue Feb 12 23:02:33 EST 2008]
12 Feb 23:02
Gordo05
Blossom:
I'm not really sure why I joined. Perhaps it is because I wanted to have the ability to contribute to a renewed Canada. Perhaps it is because I am so fed up with the Harper Conservatives that I would be willing to practically sell my political soul in order to see a change. Whatever the case, let's hope it was worth the 5 bucks!
It's both interesting and frustrating to watch the goings-on in Ottawa. The shots of the Liberals standing up and walking out of the House was a strong statement of unity. I'm sure the political pundits will all weigh in with their 2 cents worth and tell us whether it was a good idea or a bad one. In my mind the motion presented by the Conservatives on the crime bill issue was silly, and in some ways insulting to our parliamentary traditions. The walk out looked good on the Liberals.
I was watching Obama on television last night giving his "victory" speech after the so-called Potomac primaries (District of Columbia, Maryland and Virginia). I was totally spell-bound by him. I am a speech-writer myself, so I was very interested in dissecting his messages. He reminds me a little of Dr. Martin Luther King. I was just getting into the meat of his speech when CNN suddenly broke away from Obama and carried McCain's victory speech. I was very disappointed and was about to change the channel, but I decided to do an analysis of McCain's style and message. I was generally disappointed (again) in McCain. He was obviously reading from a teleprompter, whereas it appeared - at least - that Obama was speaking from his heart. If Dion can capture even one-fifth of Obama's "magic" he will become a spectacular "foil" to Harper. I have heard Harper speak - ie been at events where he has spoken. His message is always very simple and there is very little embellishment in what he says. He may be speaking from his head - but he certainly does not speak from his heart.
[updated Wed Feb 13 10:38:47 EST 2008]
13 Feb 10:38
blossom
Gordo05,
There is no other alternative...
If I may suggest, it would be very uplifting, and interesting to use your talents, and offer this help personally to M. Dion.
M. Dion is very engaging, and keeps a very open mind about initiatives that are proposed to him. You can get his email address, and email, and he will respond to you.
Also, besides the weekly Liberal letter that we receive on Friday's, he has a blog of his own, and I just did not have time to look into this. I received this notice last week.
I find that you are very enterprising, and could possibly assist with your ideas, and that I know personally, that he does pay close attention to great suggestions.
This could become a very interesting part-time enterprise for you.
I am always overwhelmed when I listen to Obama; and so downhearted when I have to listen to MacCain.
Personally, I email the Grits at info@liberal.ca, daily, and give my reactions to all that concerns me, and I especially love to tell them when they are doing it right.
Since I no longer receive, even an acknowledgement from this present gov/t,, I suspect that I have been black-listed, and consider this to be a compliment.
I must have hit a few sensitive cords!!!
As long as we are polite, we can make a difference, but I don't believe in wasting my time, and I always go to the top immediately. It is possible.
Hillary is backed by the same Old Establishment, and people are fed-up with this.
I used to thrive on Bill Clinton's speaches, and his first lie I felt was unfair, because this is a personal scandal that the republicans used, and under the belt.
However, Mr. Clinton said that he would never interfere with his wife's campaign: he did: he lied...
Mr. Clinton declared what he saw in N. Mexico: Then he lied about having access to NASA reports, and denied that he had admitted to seeing what others reported. He lied. Whitewater: another lie.
I had the chance of seeing Barack Obama about three years ago, before he even thought of running in this Presidential race, and on a one on one basis, he is electrifying. There is more substance in this one man than one can imagine. He will unite the US, rather than divide African Americans against Hispanics. The republicans divide the Country, and derive their strenght from this, and are articulate at lying!
One needs to listen carefully to all of them, especially those with whom we disagree. As Winston Churchill used to say, "Keep an eye on your enemies", and keep them close!!! It's the only way to know what they are up to.
In your own way, I can feel the energy that exudes from you, and feel that the Liberal party will be benefit. If you are up to it, go for it!
Early this Am, I listened to radio canada news, and out here all we are fed, by our Opposition parties, is about the necessity of more rigorous French laws. The Provincial Liberal party stated yesterday that we shall benefit from 1% less in our economy than had been predicted, this year. I don't think that they take this matter seriously.
With the Danny Williams', Buzz Hargrove's and many others, we shall attain a change of gov/t., and when Canadians realize that the US economy is collapsing, and we feel the crunch, the pundits won't be calling the shots.
They showed the figures for Canadians in debt this morn. How can we not pay attention to this factor. This reflects on the whole Country.
The manufacturing, and lumber sectors need far more help than what was just dished out recently...The US is already back in Court against Canada re. our softwood lumber disputes, that had been won in the Courts, but Mr. Harper moved too quickly, lost us a million dollars, Court costs, and rising tariffs to return. Anyone who is paying attention should be outraged at how this gov/t has acted on our behalf.
Good for you, and I am rooting for you!
[updated Wed Feb 13 11:56:39 EST 2008]
13 Feb 11:56
Gordo05
Blossom:
Had a busy day yesterday, so I didn't get a chance to pull together a reply. I did do some thinking about a number of your points, and I'll have to continue the thinking. I may offer some "help" to my local Liberal candidate, but I'll have to keep it fairly low key - as I am a federal public servant, and have been for just over 5 years. I did want to comment on the exchange I saw earlier between yourself and zhimmy01 (I'd love to do a study one day on how and why people come up with the silly names they use as their "nom de plumes" on these sites). I was actually using my real name for awhile here and realized that perhaps I shouldn't be doing that, so I asked the Nanos people to change my profile, which they did in a very timely fashion. I like coming on here and sharing ideas and even challenging some others. The Hollinm persons - although a devout Conservative - and I use the word devout on purpose - seems to be able to share ideas and hold to his/her own beliefs in a respectful way. But I found the tone of zhimmy01 to be almost hateful, which is another word I find Conservatives tend to use too often. As you pointed out, one didn't have to read it if one didn't want to, and besides, it was a conversation between ourselves, although we all know that others can read it if they want to. I am getting a little impatient with all the election talk - because there just doesn't seem to be a clear focus, so that perhaps helps explain why we tend to wander around in these posts. I can't figure out why the Conservatives - and I tend not to use the word Tories in connection with this latest bunch of Conservatives, because they are unlike any Tories I've ever known or worked with over the years. Greg Weston has an interesting theory in the Ottawa Sun (not exactly my favorite publication, but I like Weston) - he suggested the reason the Conservatives are trying to bring a quick end to their own government is because the economy is going to tank very soon, and Weston pointed out that the poll Nanos Research did for the Sun also showed that Canadians have lost confidence in the economy and feel much more pessimistic about the future. The latest Nanos-Sun poll has found the national mood turning decidedly cautious if not downright pessimistic. In just three months, barely half as many Canadians now think our current oil-powered economy can steer around the U.S. credit wreckage that has created fiscal chaos south of the border. The Nanos numbers show the cold shower hitting Canadians in every region of the country -- heck, consumer confidence is off sharply even in the booming West. Even in vote-rich Ontario, barely 21% of those surveyed said they believe the economy will continue to improve this year, down from 53% in November. He quoted Nik, who predicted the last two elections within a hair, as saying the latest poll numbers reflect a "dramatic shift in public confidence." These numbers are also scaring the hell out of the Conservatives. And that's why they are trying to orchestrate their own defeat. Makes sense to me...
[updated Thu Feb 14 10:01:30 EST 2008]
14 Feb 10:01
blossom
Hello Gordo05,
Please let me thank you for responding in your usual kind manner, and your perceptions, political or otherwise, are always right on.
What I immediately liked, and picked-up when I first read your post, was that you are fair, you go into debth about your deductions, and give a reliable position of the state of affairs - for all sides.
You have given me quite a few hints, and I think that I can read between the lines.
I also like Greg Weston, but I never miss the weekly pundits with Don Newman on CBC.
Last night, on the late audio news, I heard that the Harper gov/t. (is what I like to refer to them, since it is a one-man-band) acknowledged that the harpercrite gov/t had spent 31million dollars in 2007 only, for putting two (2) polls daily, and kept us on edge with daily election mode, which has instead gotten this gov/t "election fatigue".
Yes, we shall feel the crunch of the American economy - we have already felt it, and more information is coming out about the US economy which is worst than the sub-prime rate lending. This could have a direct affect as to why Harper wants to bail out.
Today, I have heard Bob Rae ask M. Dion to hold off on a present election, and I agree with him,..Mr. Harper is still baiting traps to ensure that he does call one...However, if M. Dion does call one, it is because he has had it, and hopes that the voters will understand the underlying truths, or should I say falseties that are ongoing behind the scenes.
M. Dion is a man who stands-up for his principles and values, and I see that he finds it difficult to hold back when he sees how the game is being played. I myself, and in his position, would be wild! In my own little way, I have never refrained from standing-up for the "underdog", and have never been afraid to stand up to the mightiest!!! (
This applies to all aspects of life.
Why did Gordon O"Connor state that our Canadian army own the best suitable protective dress, tanks, etc...when just today the Canadian soldiers are asking for changes, and safer garments, and artilary
I agree with you that what we are seeing is being staged by the present gov/t, and the lack of coherence is far too obvious.
Out here in Qc., when I listen to the French news, I find that a lot gets lost in the translation...Often times even addressed after an important time lapse....
For the last 8 years Americans have been in a dilemma, their Country has suffered a loss of their great reputation around the world, and are starting to worry about this. They have 130,000 troops in Iraq, Malaki had to be hospitalized for exhaustion, and was blamed for the outcome in Iraq, each time that the surge din't work. The question is that: should they send those troops to Afghanistan. This is why we are still there; because the US is still in Iraq.
Gordo05, you know the old saying that one "cannot fight City Hall alone"...This is M. Dion's dilemma.
Personally, I would prefer to see M. Dion wait to call an election for now;that time is on his hands, and won't risk losing his Leadership.
I agree that Mr. Harper wants to look good, but his party is muzzled, and that everyone is caught in his autocratic iron-hand plans. You saw what happened to Bill Casey, and others who tried to go against his wishes....We all were subjected to Mr. Harper's stronghold on those who dared to oppose him.
I trust M. Dion will do what he thinks is best, and although he doesn't have a baggage of experience yet, and his first year as Leader was untenable - no one gave him a break - not even within his own party - but used the sledge hammer on him instead.
In Qc., for years they have depicted and attacked M. Dion as an outsider.
If one goes back to 1966 when Mike Pearson won the Nobel Prize, even then his own Liberal caucus had always been totally against him, and would have wanted nothing better than to get rid of him. Today, history quotes him as having been one of our great PM's of the times.
I am in a rush also, but was so pleased that you responded, also on my behalf, and Nik is not one to censure exchange of ideas on this post. He doesn't cut one out for being at opposing ends.
PS: I have had it with the usual spin about who's who, and who's better.
Getting to the bottom of the issues, and the truth is what this is all about, and the welfare of all Canadians.
Always great reading your candid ideas, and keep up the good work.
You makes a lot of sense to me also...
PS: I had to edit half of what I posted...mostly facts and comparisons about arguments.
Thanks,
[updated Thu Feb 14 15:26:58 EST 2008]
14 Feb 15:26
Gordo05
So the question is: are the Liberals prepared to risk an election over the budget? There doesn't seem to be much of an appetite for an election over the Afghanistan issue, and the silly ploy by the Conservatives over the Senate and the Crime Bill was - well, silly. The Liberals didn't show much appetite for innovative national programs when they were in office, during a decade of staggering surpluses. The Paul Martin government only introduced child care in its dying months, and never did deliver. Whatever the reason, whether politicos want to blame a right-wing media, memories of the high deficits and debt of the eighties, a risk-averse political culture: Ottawa has become a place where bold, generous ideas come to die. As Susan Riley points out in her column in today's Ottawa Citizen, if M. Dion hopes to become prime minister, he would be ill-advised to ditch the training wheels now. Let's face it - he's really not quite ready. There is a possibility that he could "learn on the job" -- or through some kind of baptism by fire if an election was triggered in the next few weeks... But, in my view, until the Liberals become more focussed and coherent they should put off an election as long as they can. October 2009 is Harper's preferred date. It could be a reprieve for the Liberals. So I think everyone should stop the sabre rattling and get on with the job of running this country. I believe we will all be better off for it. Then let's bring on the election in 2009 and let the chips fall where they may. So it may well mean we have to "put up with" the Harperites for another 18 months... Yikes! On second thought, maybe M. Dion should just bring 'em all down.
[updated Fri Feb 15 07:44:52 EST 2008]
15 Feb 07:44
blossom
Hi Gordo05,
I think that M. Dion's planning for repairing our future infrastructure, and having a fund that both Provinces, and Municipalities will be enable to plan ahead is a plan, and that the harpercrites idea of paying down the debt with no maneuverable resources, is like paying down the mortgage, whilst the food cupboard is empty!!!
Alberta should cut down on it's tar sands activity, since we have enough energy, and the rest is being sold to the US. Huge point of contention, but citizens are being exposed to harmful substances, and they have plenty of resources, and should slow down their production.
Removing "phosphates" from our detergents has causes those algeas that we pick-up in our lake water, that is so bad, that one can not even row a boat, let alone use a motorized boat!
We are polluters, and it is time that our government comes to grip with the issues that our destroying our planet.
I would prefer that M. Dion waits, at least until next Fall to call an election; and far better that Mr. Harper stop accerbating us with election momentum since he knows that his days are numbered, and Canadians do not want another costly election at this time.
I see a huge change in M. Dion's tactics, and it almost seems as though the Grits/caucus are starting to realize that unless they come together and agree, and back their Leader, that they will be the losers.
What I would like to see is Mr. Harper, if he can't get the Grits into falling into his steadfast traps, that he would himself have the courage to go to the Governor General, and call his own downfall!!!
Responding to your reference about Peter Van Loan last week, this is one MP that Mr. Harper trusted to be outspoken, and I guess there is a reason why he keeps his MP"s muzzled.
Your reasoning is sound, as always, well thought out, and although at Xmas I was very enthusiastic for an election, because I had had enough of the harpercrites, now I would prefer to see M. Dion continue to be perceived as a man with an agenda for the future, and a strong Opponent in Parliament, and get the chance that was not his in his first year.
Where is Mr. Harper these days? Last week he was all docility, and this week nowhere to be seen. Admittedly I did miss the sessions in the House this week, but it would seem that they are keeping him in the background, rather than the forefront, when he decides to call the shots.
I also noticed that normally when Mr. Harper is attacking the Liberals, he astutetly always/invariably calls M. Dion's name personally, but last week, so as not to give any credit to M. Dion, he referred that the Liberals and his party might be able to come to terms on Afghanistan.
To quote your last paragraph, I feel the same, and am tempted,to say the heck with it, let us take our chances - Qc and Ontario are not going to sell their votes short to the harpercrite gov/t, but on the other hand, why not let them self-defeat!!!
With a little more time, the Grits will benefit from a "majority" gov/t.
Canadians will be calling for an election when they see fit!
The budget and the Speach From The Throne is when one usually votes for a vote of non-confidence. Since when does a minority gov/t place votes of confidence on any, and all issues?
I maintain that it is the economy whereby M. Dion will call an election, and this could be for next Fall. This would make sense to me. We shall feel the crunch of the downfall of the US economy, that the US gov/t is denying, and Mr. Flaherty will probably get the bloq to vote against it, or could it be that he has already introduced funds that this outlaw party will vote for?
The uncivility, disrespect that this present gov/t., disdain, and it's total disregard for the will of the citizens of Canada; I find absolutely contemptable, and is an affront to our intelligence, especially to those who voted them into a minority gov/t.
I did not vote for them!
[updated Fri Feb 15 18:25:10 EST 2008]
15 Feb 18:25
Gordo05
Blossom:
I hear that Jean Chretien is now counselling Dion to pull the plug over the budget. Things just keep getting curiouser and curiouser.
[updated Mon Feb 18 07:30:14 EST 2008]
18 Feb 07:30
blossom
Hello Gordo05,
So did I...
They are two different individuals - J.C. already had a mandate, was politically savy, and was not dealing with a conspiracy with the opposition trying to trap him into an election.
The times have changed, and M. Dion is denoting sagesse, and wisdom, and although I can understand his anger and wanting to go for an election; his caucus does not want to at this time.
Instead of doing the job that harper was appointed to do, I can we can all see the games, and traps to lure M. Dion into an early election.
The news lies in those attack ads this day, I feel, will awaken Canadians, once again, to the pitfalls of this present deceitful gov/t.
We all know that harper inherited a huge surplus, that he has withered away, by decreasing important programs and institutions; used enormous sums of monies on making false attacks against his Opponent, and is showing that he finds M. Dion to be a force to be reckoned with in the next election.
Too bad that Harper did not just govern within his minority gov/t, since Canadians have not yet called for an election, and harper, in his usual dishonest games, wants to blame M. Dion for bringing down the gov/t.
I guess, even a conservative can see the light, because harper's game has become less than intelligent, and his tactics not up to what the Canadian electorate aspires for.
Don't worry Gordo, I don't foresee an election, unless the budget is so outrageous, that it will pass. Danny Williams will not help his cause, and Ontario will vote Liberal. I am anxious to see the outcome of the elections in Alberta.
Wait till Albertans realize that Mr. haprer has sold them short to the US, and 'bush'. This harpercrite gov/t is positively throwing away energy, and just today, price of petrol in this province has gone up to $1.20 - up .17 cents in one day.
Petro-Canada is refusing to have bilingual signs at their filling stations, and I would hope that all English Canadians would boycott them, as we shall in this province. Allen J. Nutik, Pres. of Affiliation Quebec, who is a newly recognized political party who wants to protect the rights of minorities, has already emailed the President of Petro Canada, and I have followed suit with my email plea.
I hope that all Federalist Canadians on this blog will help us, in Qc from the hardships that only 20% of diehard separatists are trying to do in order to separate us.
Kosovo has earned today's Independance, and I am waiting for the harpercite govt to recognize this day, since NATO was out there in order to save them from the Russians who want to deny them their rights, after ethnic cleansing.
M. Dion is in favour of Kosovo's Independence, and the separatists out here feel that they can compare their rights for a sovereign state from Canada. I guess we can all see the absurdity.
I could not tolerate listening to Jim Prentice, and others on CTV
Sunday, last, because the questions were not answered as to what this back-room gov/t has on its agenda, and was so infuriated that it was all about knocking, not the Liberal party, but personal, and badly formed ads, attacks against M. Dion.
Is this what Canadians are asking of the present gov/t? To be on a personal tirade against one man? What about issues, policies, and running the business-side of our government?
Canadians will call an election when they are ready to pay for it, and I hope that M. Dion will continue to wait, so that we can
all see Stephen Harper self-defeat.
PS: Don't forget Thursday, Feb. 21 at 8:00PM, on CNN, a debate between Obama vs Hillary...It's easy to foresee who will be more inspirational.
Jean Chretien is angry, and I can understand that he would go for it, but the circumstances were different. Even so, if M. Dion calls an election; I still maintain a small majority win for the Liberals at worst!
The bloq (unless harper has promised a present to Premier Charest, and the NDP might vote against the budget)...The Grits are going to try to put it off until we feel the crunch of the US economy which is far worse than even they realize.
I would be ashamed if I were McCain to have 'bush' endorse me...It will do McCain harm!
I would hope that at all costs: M. DIon would avoid the pot holes, and take the time to build a safe highway!!! A little more time!
Besides Canadians are riveted on the US elections, a first since JFK, and I would use my wisdom to build a strong platform campaign, and wait for Canadians to be aware of what is really going on in the harpercrite camp.
Gordo, what ever happened to fair play?
Cheers,
[updated Mon Feb 18 18:33:45 EST 2008]
18 Feb 18:33
Gordo05
Blossom:
Finally have a little time to reflect on your post and provide some feedback of a more substantive nature. I was interested in reading about Jim Prentice's attempt at painting the Liberals as free-spenders who will plunge the country at least $62.5 billion deeper into debt over the next four years if they follow through on their promises. They even have a 65-page book that outlines the Liberals free-spending commitments made since M. Dion became leader. I guess this is what we can come to expect when the election is eventually called. Who calls a news conference on Sunday, anyway???
I was interested in Liberal finance critic John McCallum's immediate response, saying that the report is a “gross distortion” of his party’s plans. “It’s a $62-billion Conservative lie. I used to be chief economist for the Royal Bank, and I’ve never seen such a shoddy, inaccurate, let alone dishonest, document,” said McCallum in an interview with CTV and the Globe and Mail. He added that if elected, the Liberals top priority would be to balance the budget. “We would phase our plans so as never to go into deficit.”
Ian L. MacDonald has another interesting column in the Gazette which was titled - The election no one wants. (I think I want one, but I guess I don't count.) Anyway, MacDonald reaches the conclusion that with the Bloc Québécois and NDP both itching for an election, it's all on M. Dion's shoulders. I've stated before here on this site that the fate of this parliament is really in M. Dion's hands - or on his shoulders - pick whatever analogy fits. I think with the "blessing" of the savvy M. Chretien, M. Dion has now decided to pull the plug on the budget. So, I say bring it on, and let's rumble.
[updated Mon Feb 18 13:20:15 EST 2008]
18 Feb 13:20
calmecam
Gordo:
I too saw Mr Prentice's pathetic performance on Question Period... and good on the interviewer for calling him out on his evasiveness.
Mr Prentice repeated about five times that the goal of the document was, to expose the fact that Liberals want to send us further in debt -- ridiculous; and talk about sticking to your media lines! Sheeesh!
Every time he repeated the point, I kept hearing: "The goal of this report is to stick it to the Liberals".
By the time the interview was over, Prentice's number had jumped from $62.5 billion to about $95 billion.
Considering the Chrétien-Martin legacy of deficit-fighting, do Conservatives really believe that Canadians would buy this argument? If there are only two argument the Liberals can take to the bank, they would be: 1) They will be competent managers of the economy and 2) Dion will do something concrete about the environment.
Prentice spent the entire time of his interview speaking about what the Liberals want to do for Canada, and 0 time speaking of what the Conservatives want to do for Canada... even after repeated prompting.
The first sign that you are in trouble in politics is when people start laughing at you rather than with you. The second sign is
when you start speaking more of the other guy than of yourself.
Both are currently taking place with the Conservatives.
Though I would love the by-elections to take place so Mr. Dion could get the "bump" that goes with it, I too say "bring it on!".
I sense that though Canadians are fine with the concept of PM Harper being kept "in check" with a minority government, once the chance to give him the boot becomes real, they'll jump at the opportunity. I know I would.
Harper staked his first mandate and leadership on a securing a majority next time. Anything less than a majority win for Harper will prompt a leadership review, and eventually his ouster (there is no way in hell Conservative MPs will remain muzzled for another two years)!
The campaign will be a fantastic contrast of styles and I have the sense it will be a "tortoise-and-the-hare" affair. PM Harper will have a bombastic launch, but a month's worth of daily strident screaming will result in Canadians tuning the Conservatives out, to listen to Dion, who will likely be more calm and poised. Slow and steady wins the race...
[updated Mon Feb 18 15:57:16 EST 2008]
18 Feb 15:57
blossom
Hi Gordo05,
Yes, I heard, and mentioned in my two minute ago email to you. John McCallum set the record straigh today, and I agree with him that any one paying attention to the harpercrite rot!!!
I mentioned to you in my last email that since 1929 the conservatives had had deficit budgets, and with the Grits, harper inherited what he is throwing away for us.
Remember that I told you that I turned Jim Prentice off yesterday, because he refused to answer any pertinent questions asked by Bob Fife, it was even underlined during the interview, and Mr. Prentice just rudely continued to lie to us.
When have you ever heard a pertinent response from the harpercrite gov/t, or gotten transparency or accountability since they were voted into office.
When they are not muzzled, they go on this tirade of blaming the Grits, or anyone and anything that falls their way.
On climate change, when Rona Ambrose left for the airport that evening to the summit, she promised all that she was going to do, and was ousted out of her Ministry when she returned. The world rediculed her. She took the flack for Harper.
John Baird in Bali kept his job, but lost us our upstanding reputation, by siding with the 'bush' alaternative.
The Financie Minister has been rediculed, and will be ousted when the Canadian economy flinches for not addressing what is coming...
I always like to figure out what Mr. MacDonald's real game is?He usually takes the option of not being too controversial, doesn't make waves, and wouldn't always bet on his horses!
I also want an election, but I do not want to be bullied into one. There is an enormous cost to this, and as pointed out by Mr. MacDonald, I don't hear cries asking for one.
We have enough of our nationalist dissidents out here, who on a daily basis are trying to shake another election, in less than one year, and the repurcussions fo a Federal election, at this time, and Mr. Harper should consider this fact, could be very damaging in our provoince.
Mr. Harper has rendered Parliament dysfunctional, and this is not Democratic, and the way it should be!
The smart thing would be for all those who have muscular leverage to call Mr. Harper to attention, to do the job that he asked, when he asked to be elected. He had not asked for a majority, and he got more than he deserved!
Keep thinking, and writing...Your exposes are terrific, and honest.
It's quite a background that you have. I am impressed! And I really enjoy exchanging ideas with someone who is intelligent.
This is how we learn!
[updated Mon Feb 18 19:01:45 EST 2008]
18 Feb 19:01
calmecam
Blossom:
With all due respect, I think that the cost of an election (about $300 - 400 million) is totally negligeable when compared to the costs of allowing Flaherty to be in control of the nation's purse for another second!
It most certainly pales in comparison to the cost resulting from the hit Canada's reputation has taken abroad since they've come into power. We've probably lost that much and more already from decreased trade with China alone based on the Conservative's ham-handed approach to diplomacy.
Bullied into one or not, any election that will result in the ouster of Harper and the Mike Harris Conservatives currently in caucus/Cabinet who opportunistically jumped on Harper's bandwagon after being fired in Ontario, will likely wind up saving us money in the end.
Bring it on before Flaherty leaves us with another deficit like he (and Eves) did in Ontario!
[updated Mon Feb 18 19:55:02 EST 2008]